Questions and Answers about Todd Bentley & Lakeland

The post is a good one, but one thing that will always be remembered not matter what good was done or not done, it will always be tained because of TB did. People tend to remember the bad and never the good, if good was done

Kathi,

For the record, it wasn’t me that said the thing about pride, but I can see where whoever said it was coming from. I can point to a Mormon friend of mine who is very secure in his spiritual life, his relationship with God and with Christ, and I can also point to a woman involved in what I consider to be a cult (The Family International) who I’ve been e-mailing back and forth with, who denied the child abuse by her cult’s founders and said to me, “Jesus’ work was ill spoken of, too!”… which is the response I get a lot when people have doubts about Todd Bentley or other controversial people. She is very sure of herself and of her relationship with Christ. Do I doubt she is seeking Christ with all she has? Nope. Do I think she is convinced of the innocence of her leaders? Yep. I don’t doubt her sincerity, but I do wonder if she is seeing clearly or if she has been blinded by something somewhere along the line.

I think it’s a cop out to say that people who speak out about the problems with Bentley are lacking charity. As a parent, I am sure you can agree that disapproval of actions does not equate to an absence of love. You keep making statements like “what you SHOULD be doing is XYZ”, usually saying people should go “pray about it”… prayer is wonderful, but prayer is like the fuel of evangelism. That is not to say that prayer cannot stand on its own, because it can, but oftentimes people are called to do more than just pray. It’s the difference between apostolic and contemplative.

I don’t doubt that there are people out there who are uncharitable in the way they speak about Todd Bentley, but I would venture to say that they are not the majority. I am willing to bet that people like myself make up the majority of naysayers. However, these uncharitable/extreme naysayers… they are people too. With flaws, as you said. And when you imply that they aren’t real Christians, or that “maybe they will get saved”, I have to wonder what it is that you think makes you so different from them. What could be more hateful than hurling accusations at fellow Christians that they hate Christ? What could be less charitable?

OH HOW ANNOYING. I just typed out a really long comment and it got eaten when I git submit.

lol.

Try numero dos.

Kathi,

For the record I am not the one who said the thing about pride, but I do understand it. Lots of people who are not on the right path think that they have a great relationship with God and/or Christ. I have a Mormon friend named Joe, for one. I have been in e-mail correspondence with a lady from The Family International who feels her relationship with Christ is superb (and it very well may be…) and when I asked her about the abuse that occurred at the hands of TFI’s founders, she denied it (though photographic evidence is well-documented and available freely online) and said to me, “Jesus’ work was ill spoke of, too.”

Ironically, that’s the response that I get from a lot of people when sharing doubts about Todd Bentley. That, or I get people telling me that I have blasphemed against the Holy Spirit, the unforgivable sin, by having (and sharing) doubts about TB.

I think it’s a cop out to say that people who speak out against TB are lacking charity. As a parent, I am sure you can agree that disapproval does not equate to an absence of love. I would also venture to say that the people who lack charity in their presentation of arguments against TB are not the majority of TB naysayers.

But even if they were, I would point out that they are just people, too. With flaws, like you said. What makes you so different than them, when you imply that they aren’t really Christians or that they “maybe they’ll be saved”? What is charitable about hurling accusations at fellow Christians that they hate Christ?

Have you created a length limit on comments?

Alycin, I *hate* when that happens!! Sometimes I compose really long comments in Word, and then paste them in, for that reason.

Looking forward to what you have to say!

Alycin – not that I know of!! Let me go and look…

I just read your thing about approving comments… but some of mine are going through okay… I have tried several times… I thought maybe it was too length so I tried breaking it up… do you have keywords that block comments? Maybe I hit one somehow…

Nope – no restrictions that I can see. Maybe WP has some internal limits??? I’ve posted some LONG comments before and not had a problem.

If you need to, break it up and post several, or email it to me, and I’ll try.

Sorry for the trouble!

I just read your thing about approving comments… but some of mine are going through okay… I have tried several times… I thought maybe it was too length so I tried breaking it up… do you have keywords that block comments? Maybe I hit one somehow…

Are you getting an error message?

AHA! Akismet caught them, too. I posted two of them – the third said the same words and I think you were copying/pasting to try breaking it up.

I went ahead and did two, even though they say essentially the same thing, because you expanded more on a point in the first one…

Again, why is Akismet doing this (after a couple of years of 99.9% accuracy)??

:::scratches head:::

Haha… well, that works. Yeah, I was typing the second try from memory, so it came out PRETTY darn similar to the first one. Thanks… though I just typed it all over again in word.

While I’m feeling sympathy for TB’s wife and especially children, not to mention his followers that will no doubt be affected by this, I am not feeling the tiniest bit sorry for TB.

This man took on a very serious position – a ministry of huge magnitude. Thousands looked up to him (whether they should have or not matters not, you know they did), believed in him, hung on his every word. They were born again through his teachings, healed(?) through his teachings, and found their faith in God strengthened, as you did Kathi, through his teachings. Not a little job he committed to!

Yes, every man sins, but when you make a commitment like this to God, his word, and the many souls that you in a sense become responsible for…well, I feel a little self-control might have been the better choice?!

This revival hadn’t even come to a close yet! He couldn’t have found strength within himself to tell this woman she could no longer work for him?! I mean, if not for the God that he proclaims to know so well, or for his wife and children, or for the thousands that follow and support him, then why not, at the very least, for the hundreds of people that have been standing by watching and trying to decide if he truly was of God or not?! Wasn’t there anything to make this man think twice??

I’m sorry. This AM I was brokenhearted, for his family, for his followers, for you Kathi. I still am. But this afternoon I’ve become just a little angry at this man. Too many people left disillusioned. Once again!

Todd Bentley, foolish move buddy!

Playing devil’s advocate as my position on TB is very clear.

Everyone sins. Some of them become more public than others, and some of them create more scandal than others. But the sins do not discredit, necessarily, the work for Christ that said sinner did before.

I was incredibly (spiritually) nourished at a Baptist church in the town I grew up in. I was young, 12, when I started going to Sunday school and the Wednesday youth program. For the next year and a half, I grew closer to Christ and became happier and more fulfilled than I had ever been before–in large part due to the youth minister there. And then one day, out of nowhere, my youth minister tried to initiate sex with me.

It shattered my entire world. I could not BELIEVE it. I was shocked and my emotional and spiritual life crumbled.

But many people, to this day even, I’m sure, would talk about how this youth minister influenced them and helped them grow closer to Christ. They wouldn’t be lying–it is the truth, I am sure. He made a mistake and that mistake cost me–and probably him–big time. But his work for God beforehand was still valid in many ways…

I dunno if that makes much sense… but I thought it was worth a try.

Donna, I agree with you to large extent. No doubt it was a “foolish move” on his part. No doubt he failed. How COULD he? Especially one who walked with God so closely?

You’re asking valid questions, Donna. The answers to them aren’t easy, and perhaps we’ll have to wait until we see Jesus face to face to know about some things (if they even matter, compared to His glory!)

How can anyone fail God and fall? How about Adam (who knew God in the intimacy of the Garden), or King David (anointed of God and a man after God’s own heart), or Peter (who walked with Jesus *personally*)?

And no doubt that God will hold him to account and yet forgive him as he repents – as He does any of us when we sin (…do not despise the chastening of the Lord…For they [human fathers] indeed for a few days chastened us as seemed best to them, but He for our profit, that we may be partakers of His holiness…afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness for those who have been trained by it. Hebrews 12:5,10,11).

Alycin, thank you for sharing that experience :::hugs:::

I don’t feel angry with Todd; I tend to think of him as a young and foolish believer. My stronger feelings are reserved for all those people who put him on a platform instead of encouraging him to sort out the longstanding family problems; the pastor Strader from Ignited Church has stated Todd and Shonnah have been in counselling for several years, and then C. Peter Wagner’s lot went down the ‘commissioning’ route. They had no business taking a man in a troubled state and putting him into the limelight in front of the cameras. I can only imagine the pressure that was on him in this global ‘personality cult,’ and it doesn’t seem there was any older more mature man around that he could confide in. So there he was down in Florida on stage nightly for months while his family seem to have been elsewhere. Where was the concern and support for Shonnah who needed her husband and the kids who needed their father? It was like a rockstar on tour; the whole thing seems like a runaway train where no-one could reach the brakes before the wreck happened.

I also feel a particular burden for this ‘other woman’ whoever she is; those in the inner circle will no doubt ostracise her, I should imagine she’ll cease working for the ministry, and I hope she too encounters a wise Christian who can lead her towards repentance and forgiveness. It’s a Corinthian situation alright.

I agree much with what you said here, Kathi. People may be saying “Oh NOOO! He sinned! His entire approach may be all wrong! My faith is shattered!”

I pray for those who will waver as a result of this fallout. Goodness knows it happened with far too many when [I can't believe I'm bringing this up, but it's relevant] the priest scandal broke.

People are infallible. People sin. That doesn’t mean they’re not of God. It it did, none of us would belong to Him.

As much as I may disagree with TB, it’s time to step up and pray for him, and for his family.

been at my church with family and friends today so haven’t been able to comment. Kathi, what will be said is there was nothing bibical about TB. Again its never the good people remember its always the bad. Pete Rose remembered for gambling, not a player, OJ killing his wife, but found not guilty, and still has to be knocked for it. So the bottom line is, he fell, now has to pick himself up. And really if he was having marriage problems he should have prayed and sought heavy advice before he did the revival. It is a shame, but the witch doctors will come after him strong and we may never hear of him again.

I think you may be referring to my comment on being carefull not to be pridefull in our own “perception” of our relationship with Jesus….just like whatshisname Peter

>> before he did the revival<<

Rev, that's the thing… HE didn't "do" the revival.

Beyond the first couple of days of it – which is what most churches do when they have "revival" services – and the thing picked up steam – that wasn't something man could've planned, IMHO.